WSU Selling Out the Koch

[TrueBlueJay]

Kudos and applause for WSU selling out the Koch. That is awesome...in all seriousness you guys have some great fans.

Question for you - with it being sold out and no chance for newbies to come in and get tickets, do you ever foresee this as being a not so good thing?

I can see this as being a possible negative in few ways:

1. Most older folks are just not as loud and rowdy as the youngsters. As your season ticket population ages, it could bring down the intesity of the Roundhouse. I believe this happened to NU football in the 80's and 90's.

2. No room for newbies to jump on the bandwagon. While I'm sure you will have a good TV package and many will be able to watch your team, do you think it will still detract in the future if you can't attract a new set of fans to the arena?

3. Along the lines of the newbies not being able to get in to enjoy the atmosphere - what happens to the students that are graduating and staying in the Wichita area? Seems that many of these people would pretty much kill to get tickets, but will be unable to.

Thoughts?

[dawg_tired nemesis]

I'm not sure what type of long term problems there will be "IF" we can sustain ourselves near the top of the valley. I do not believe Koch can be renovated to accomodate any further seating. WSU needs to bring back shocker vision, which shows all the home games. Maybe once the downtown arena is built they can have 1 or 2 games a year there, it will hold around 15,000.

[Born2Shock]

I do see your point. But it doesnt seem to harm most of the big basketball schools. For right now, this does seem to be a nice 'reward' for people that got and have held onto their tickets during the dark ages. It is nice that these true fans are being rewarded before the bandwagoners.

[rjl]

It sucks to not have a ticket, but like Born2Shock said, it happens at all the big basketball schools too.

The way season tickets were selling this year, Koch could hold 14K + and it would still be sold out like it is now.

That said, the people I really feel for are students who are just graduating. Most others had their chance last year or the year before and didn't take it.

But heck, enrollment may increase as all graduating students will take a few Master's classes so they can still get the student tickets.

[blueblood]

Good news is a known revenue flow. Bad news is to follow DaShox WSU is everybodies rival take it to the next level national champion every year model your donations and ticket prices are going to have to go up each and every year. A lot. Either that or since you are now with the Notre Dames of the world you sign a TV deal with NBC. I see the donation, rise in ticket price as more likely.

[rjl]

Good news is a known revenue flow. Bad news is to follow DaShox WSU is everybodies rival take it to the next level national champion every year model your donations and ticket prices are going to have to go up each and every year. A lot. Either that or since you are now with the Notre Dames of the world you sign a TV deal with NBC. I see the donation, rise in ticket price as more likely.

Ticket prices and donations have already risen enough to cover added expenses over last year (mainly Turg's salary).

And I'm not sure what the "DaShox WSU is everybodies rival" thing has to do with revenue....

If you are talking about SU, there's a reason the call the Syracuse game a "buyout" game. With an arena the size and capacity of the Carrier Dome, I'd assume they essentially pay you what you would have made on a return game.

Merchandise sales have gone up considerally over last season, and last season the over the year before.... Then there's the NCAA Tournament money.

I'm also going to assume the advertising space around the court at Koch has gone up considerably as well.

[RoyalShock]

I don't see the donation amounts rising as much as the ticket price. The donation is tied to the costs of tuition and fees, mostly. But blueblood is right, I'm sure the ticket costs will rise.

Looking at Gonzaga as a model (not the WCC, just Gonzaga). Their arena seats 6000 and is sold out through 2009. Can anyone weigh in with how similar Gonzaga/Spokane is to WSU/Wichita in terms of city size, the city's perception of (or association to) the school and the overall buzz around the city?


If WSU can maintain a few years of success, maybe the demand will be so great that the funds will come to add a couple thousand seats. Right now the season ticket waiting list is at 250. If that number could reach 1000 or more after an escalation of ticket prices (into the $250-$300 per seat range), and an increase in student ticket demand, then I would think the AD should begin looking into the feasibility of an expansion.

[C0|db|00ded]

Kudos and applause for WSU selling out the Koch. That is awesome...in all seriousness you guys have some great fans.

Question for you - with it being sold out and no chance for newbies to come in and get tickets, do you ever foresee this as being a not so good thing?

I can see this as being a possible negative in few ways:

1. Most older folks are just not as loud and rowdy as the youngsters. As your season ticket population ages, it could bring down the intesity of the Roundhouse. I believe this happened to NU football in the 80's and 90's.

2. No room for newbies to jump on the bandwagon. While I'm sure you will have a good TV package and many will be able to watch your team, do you think it will still detract in the future if you can't attract a new set of fans to the arena?

3. Along the lines of the newbies not being able to get in to enjoy the atmosphere - what happens to the students that are graduating and staying in the Wichita area? Seems that many of these people would pretty much kill to get tickets, but will be unable to.

Thoughts?

There is nothing to worry about except on-court success. If Wichita State continues to win and build on their national reputation everything will work itself out. Many of the leading programs in America have sold out arenas (some around 10k) with no plans for expansion. Television offers us unlimited potential for exposure and revenue and will be more greatly utilized as our national successes grow. If Jim Schaus and Mark Turgeon were to stay at Wichita State for the next 10 years, I have no doubt that we could very likely be... the next Gonzaga. The key to our future is holding onto our current management.

It's a great day to be a Shocker!


T


...:cool:

[barkeep1967]

Then there's the NCAA Tournament money.

Not sure why but that is not paid untill 5 years after your appearance.

[MoValley John]

Looking at Gonzaga as a model (not the WCC, just Gonzaga). Their arena seats 6000 and is sold out through 2009. Can anyone weigh in with how similar Gonzaga/Spokane is to WSU/Wichita in terms of city size, the city's perception of (or association to) the school and the overall buzz around the city?


With the exception of Drake, which doesn't sell out it's 7,002 seat arena, wouldn't just about every team in the Valley be sold out with a 6,000 per game max?

[shockball]

Required donations went up for this years tickets. There was about a 5% increase to keep the same seats as last year. Also, the seating that requires a donation was expanded by about 300 seats. This can be done many more times before all seating requires a donation.

[outpost]

I think that Spokane is much smaller than Wichita. It's out in Eastern Washington, more of a rural community. Boeing had a facility there, but sold it a few years ago, if I remember correctly.

I also think that Pullman, and Washington State University (WSU) are not too far away. Anyway, here's a link with a good map of Washington, with Pullman a bit south of Spokane.

http://www.gonorthwest.com/Washington/washington-state-map.htm

[MoValley John]

I just was lurking on the KSU board on ESPN. There is a thread where KSU fans are dogging on WSU, calling it the 3rd best team in Kansas. There was a little love for recent WSU success, but not much. Several posts berate the quality of the Valley and said that the WSU run was because you were overlooked. Since several posters on VT have reported that WSU fans are pretty good at rigging polls etc., now would be a good time to jump on that board and fix it. Just thought that I would help you straighten this matter out.

[MoValley John]

KU fan just backed up WSU, but you guys need to set the record straight. Here's the link.
http://forums.espn.go.com/espn/thread?forumID=288&threadID=4135836&lastPostID=27109383

[outpost]

They're not worth it MVJ. It's not like anything is gonna change with them.

They're too scared to tell their AD to back up their boast of alleged superiority by scheduling a game with us.

We have a few trolls on shockernet, and I'm satisfied enough by bringing the battle to them on that forum.

Let 'em talk themselves up, maybe we'll get a crack at 'em in Las Vegas in late December.

[MoValley John]

They're not worth it MVJ. It's not like anything is gonna change with them.

They're too scared to tell their AD to back up their boast of alleged superiority by scheduling a game with us.

We have a few trolls on shockernet, and I'm satisfied enough by bringing the battle to them on that forum.

Let 'em talk themselves up, maybe we'll get a crack at 'em in Las Vegas in late December.

You have a few KSU trolls on Shockernet? Amazing! KSU fan is so thin skinned that their moderators, both on the espn board and the powercat board will ban just about anyone who dares to criticize. I have never posted there, but I have seen their mod's carnage.

[outpost]

Believe me, KSU fans lead the nation in Koolaid consumption

[MoValley John]

What else are you going to do when you live in Manhattan?:innocent:

[goshoxgo]

With the exception of Drake, which doesn't sell out it's 7,002 seat arena, wouldn't just about every team in the Valley be sold out with a 6,000 per game max?


Just the opposite:

CU/17,000
WSU,BU,ILL ST, IND ST, EU/ all 10,200 to 11,600
SIU/9,600
MSU/8,800 - and soon to be 14,000?
UNI/ 7,500 I think thats what the mclead center will be, can't remember.

so 7 teams with 9,600+ capacity arenas, soon to be 8 schools.

[MoValley John]

For those of us with a few grey hairs, we remember another WCC power, Loyola Marymount. They were great in the 80's, had another 6+ seat arena. They defined what uptempo offense was. Off the top of my head, they had a goal to put up a shot within 10 seconds. As prolific as their offense was, their defense was just as bad. Their defense was worse than the NBA. Fun games to watch though.

[The Mad Hatter]

Just the opposite:

CU/17,000
WSU,BU,ILL ST, IND ST, EU/ all 10,200 to 11,600
SIU/9,600
MSU/8,800 - and soon to be 14,000?
UNI/ 7,500 I think thats what the mclead center will be, can't remember.

so 7 teams with 9,600+ capacity arenas, soon to be 8 schools.

The question was wouldn't all Valley schools, except maybe Drake, sell out a Gonzaga sized arena. Given the capacity of most Valley arenas, selling out 6,000 seats with season tickets would be feasible for many on the Valley schools. Most would sell out the arena, but not all of them would do it on season tickets, in my estimation. (I could be wrong. If someone has season ticket numbers feel free to correct me.)

[MoValley John]

The question was wouldn't all Valley schools, except maybe Drake, sell out a Gonzaga sized arena. Given the capacity of most Valley arenas, selling out 6,000 seats with season tickets would be feasible for many on the Valley schools. Most would sell out the arena, but not all of them would do it on season tickets, in my estimation. (I could be wrong. If someone has season ticket numbers feel free to correct me.)

IMO, if the Valley had smaller arenas, it would cause many casual fans to buy season tix, most teams selling out 6K easily.

[iSASO]

Kudos and applause for WSU selling out the Koch. That is awesome...in all seriousness you guys have some great fans.

Question for you - with it being sold out and no chance for newbies to come in and get tickets, do you ever foresee this as being a not so good thing?

I can see this as being a possible negative in few ways:

1. Most older folks are just not as loud and rowdy as the youngsters. As your season ticket population ages, it could bring down the intesity of the Roundhouse. I believe this happened to NU football in the 80's and 90's.

2. No room for newbies to jump on the bandwagon. While I'm sure you will have a good TV package and many will be able to watch your team, do you think it will still detract in the future if you can't attract a new set of fans to the arena?

3. Along the lines of the newbies not being able to get in to enjoy the atmosphere - what happens to the students that are graduating and staying in the Wichita area? Seems that many of these people would pretty much kill to get tickets, but will be unable to.

Thoughts?

My thoughts? Since I know of a certain 22-month-old who will be attending games this year...
Yes, your theory is correct. By the time he reaches the ripe old age of 6, he may not be able to 'bring it' like he can right now. It sucks getting old.

[WSUfan]

I think you have to consider the prices of tickets at different arenas. How much is a ticket to a Gonzaga (home) game? Would 6000 DU fans pay that much? SIU fans? WSU fans?

[MoValley John]

Just checked the Zags site. Sold out, but face value is $20 for all tix and to get on the waiting list, you must be a Bulldog member- $200/yr. Cheaper than most CU and WSU tix.

[RoyalShock]

Currently, you don't have to make a SASO donation at WSU to get a season ticket, let alone get on the waiting list. I think single seats at a WSU game last year were $17.

I followed that link to KSU's ESPN board. Basically, it's one very ignorant KSU poster/student getting educated by another KSU student who actually understands a little about college basketball. Most KSU fans tend to hide behind their conference and spout "scoreboard" from three years ago when it comes to any real basketball debate concerning WSU.

[barkeep1967]

KSU fans tend to hide behind their conference

Just point out to them that the big 12 has a grand total of 1 national title in the last 50 years. That tends to calm everybody but the dumb *** Jayhawks fans.

[MoValley John]

Currently, you don't have to make a SASO donation at WSU to get a season ticket, let alone get on the waiting list. I think single seats at a WSU game last year were $17.

The last time I was at the Roundhouse was 3 years ago. I think I paid about 15-$20. If WSU was only charging $17 a seat last year, that should have been addressed before tix went on sale this year. IMO, with the demand for tix last year, cheap seats should be at least $25 this year, with a donation required for up to 75% of the seats. Good seats should be 30-$35/game. Almost anyone can afford $25, those that want the good seats will pay. The revenue would be good for WSU.

[rjl]

The last time I was at the Roundhouse was 3 years ago. I think I paid about 15-$20. If WSU was only charging $17 a seat last year, that should have been addressed before tix went on sale this year. IMO, with the demand for tix last year, cheap seats should be at least $25 this year, with a donation required for up to 75% of the seats. Good seats should be 30-$35/game. Almost anyone can afford $25, those that want the good seats will pay. The revenue would be good for WSU.

I think they were probably worried about the PR nightmare of raising ticket prices that much at the same time as Turgeon's payraise.

Turg's raise was covered via other methods, so the ticket price increase was minimal. In the next few years, I see them going up $2 each a year, tops.

The number of season tickets that can be purchased without SASO membership is small, and they are all located in one section up in the rafters.

Still good seats, but the number of them is shrinking.

[MoValley John]

I think they were probably worried about the PR nightmare of raising ticket prices that much at the same time as Turgeon's payraise.

Turg's raise was covered via other methods, so the ticket price increase was minimal. In the next few years, I see them going up $2 each a year, tops.

The number of season tickets that can be purchased without SASO membership is small, and they are all located in one section up in the rafters.

Still good seats, but the number of them is shrinking.

I'm an advertising guy, your a marketing guy. Both of us know that with the right message that this could be done with little damage. Too bad that the universities and their AD's, not just WSU, but almost all of them, can't figure out how easy it can be to market price increases without alarming the public.

[SB Shock]

I'm an advertising guy, your a marketing guy. Both of us know that with the right message that this could be done with little damage. Too bad that the universities and their AD's, not just WSU, but almost all of them, can't figure out how easy it can be to market price increases without alarming the public.

With the likes of the following teams on a home schedule:

Rockhurst
Chicago St.
UMKC
Kennedaw St.
Maryland Eastern-Shore

There will be a revolt if they think they can raise ticket prices with this type of non-conference schedule. I don't care how good you used car advertiser and marketeers are, nobody will be buying your "spin".

[MoValley John]

With the likes of the following teams on a home schedule:

Rockhurst
Chicago St.
UMKC
Kennedaw St.
Maryland Eastern-Shore

There will be a revolt if they think they can raise ticket prices with this type of non-conference schedule. I don't care how good you used car advertiser and marketeers are, nobody will be buying your "spin".

I culd retype the whole thing, but look at my response on the Turgeon talks scheduling thread. Given time, I could sell a blind guy a Corvettte.

[shockball]

The last time I was at the Roundhouse was 3 years ago. I think I paid about 15-$20. If WSU was only charging $17 a seat last year, that should have been addressed before tix went on sale this year. IMO, with the demand for tix last year, cheap seats should be at least $25 this year, with a donation required for up to 75% of the seats. Good seats should be 30-$35/game. Almost anyone can afford $25, those that want the good seats will pay. The revenue would be good for WSU.

The sections that do not require SASO donations shrunk this year by about 300 seats. It is now less than 20% of the seats.

A very large SASO increase ocurred before the 2005-06 season. A 5% increase in each donation level was required this year in order to keep the same seats.

The shrinking non SASO area and increases in contribution levels can be expected to continue.

[TrueBlueJay]

My thoughts? Since I know of a certain 22-month-old who will be attending games this year...


Can he really be almost 2?

[iSASO]

Yes, he can and he is.

[shockball]

Heard any references to mini me?:innocent:

[iSASO]

Yes, except he has a good throwing arm.